Legislature(2019 - 2020)BARNES 124

03/13/2020 01:00 PM House RESOURCES

Note: the audio and video recordings are distinct records and are obtained from different sources. As such there may be key differences between the two. The audio recordings are captured by our records offices as the official record of the meeting and will have more accurate timestamps. Use the icons to switch between them.

Download Mp3. <- Right click and save file as

* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+= HB 240 REGULATE PFAS USE; FIRE/WATER SAFETY TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
+ HB 218 SALT WATER FISHING: OPERATORS/GUIDES TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Public Testimony --
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
+= HB 138 NATIONAL RESOURCE WATER DESIGNATION TELECONFERENCED
Heard & Held
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
          HB 240-REGULATE PFAS USE; FIRE/WATER SAFETY                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
1:05:18 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN announced  the first order of  business would be                                                               
HOUSE BILL NO.  240, "An Act relating to  pollutants; relating to                                                               
perfluoroalkyl  and polyfluoroalkyl  substances; relating  to the                                                               
duties  of  the  Department of  Environmental  Conservation;  and                                                               
relating to firefighting substances."                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN  reminded the  committee that HB  240 would                                                               
set in statute standards for clean drinking water and assure                                                                    
 that  Alaskans  who  have been  exposed  to  perfluoroalkyl  and                                                               
polyfluoroalkyl   (PFAS)  substances   have  options   for  blood                                                               
monitoring.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:07:12 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
RANDY  KRAUSE,  Fire  Chief, Port  of  Seattle  Fire  Department,                                                               
paraphrased  from  the   following  written  testimony  [original                                                               
punctuation provided]:                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Thank  you  to  the  members  of  the  House  Resources                                                                    
     Committee for allowing me to testify today.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     My name is Randy Krause, and  I serve as the Fire Chief                                                                    
     for the  Port of  Seattle providing service  to Sea-Tac                                                                    
     International Airport.  I am  here to share  my support                                                                    
     for the bill  before you, and to  thank Committee Chair                                                                    
     Tarr  and sponsoring  Representative  Hannan for  their                                                                    
     leadership.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     At the Port of Seattle,  we have been actively involved                                                                    
     with the  industry to find  a solution and  are working                                                                    
     with   our    partners   at   the    Federal   Aviation                                                                    
     Administration to  encourage the implementation  of new                                                                    
     fluorine-free firefighting foam.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     While  federal  law  currently   requires  the  use  of                                                                    
     firefighting  foam that  includes  PFAS chemicals,  our                                                                    
     airport director Lance Lyttle sent  the FAA a letter in                                                                    
     2018 urging the FAA  to aggressively pursue a fluorine-                                                                    
     free option.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     The  2018 FAA  Reauthorization Act  passed by  Congress                                                                    
     requires   the   evaluation   and   implementation   of                                                                    
     fluorine-free foam by the end of 2021.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Many  of my  peers at  airports across  the globe  have                                                                    
     already made  the change  to fluorine  free foam  and I                                                                    
     personally have witnessed fluorine  free foam used with                                                                    
     great  success and  am confident  the FAA  will find  a                                                                    
     suitable alternative within the deadline.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     We recognize that there is  concern in the firefighting                                                                    
     industry with the FAA meeting its 2021 deadline.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     I, however, am confident the  FAA will reach a solution                                                                    
     and I am looking forward to  being one if not the first                                                                    
     airport in the United States to go fluorine free.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     We do  understand these types  of bills  have differing                                                                    
     effects  on various  industries.  It  appears you  have                                                                    
     addressed  some of  the concerns  we had  in Washington                                                                    
     state with this bill and we  are happy to work with and                                                                    
     help the sponsors as this moves forward.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     Thank  you, and  with that  I  am happy  to answer  any                                                                    
     questions.                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR asked  Mr. Krause  how  he could  assist the  bill                                                               
sponsor.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MR.  KRAUSE answered  that through  various organizations  he has                                                               
been searching  for a suitable  alternative for  the firefighting                                                               
industry  at  airports  and  soon will  be  involved  in  Federal                                                               
Aviation    Administration    (FAA),     U.S.    Department    of                                                               
Transportation,  testing   fluorine-free  products.     The  U.S.                                                               
approach to  finding a fluorine-free product  has been tentative;                                                               
however,  Heathrow  Airport   Limited,  Copenhagen  Airport,  and                                                               
airports  in  Australia  and  all of  the  United  Kingdom,  have                                                               
switched  to   fluorine-free  foam,  are  comfortable   with  the                                                               
product, and  are excited because  it is a  biodegradable product                                                               
with  zero  cleanup   costs  or  impacts.     Speaking  from  his                                                               
experience, he said he offered his  help to the fire chief at the                                                               
Ted  Stevens Anchorage  International Airport  and seeks  to keep                                                               
all those working  in the firefighting industry  apprised in this                                                               
regard.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR  noted the  transition  to  alternatives by  large                                                               
international airports could serve as a model for Alaska.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  KRAUSE advised  that FAA  has a  list of  products that  are                                                               
approved for  use at  airports, none  of which  are fluorine-free                                                               
foam; however, there is a  new testing facility to test fluorine-                                                               
free foam,  and he  and others  are urging  FAA to  find suitable                                                               
products soon.   Internationally,  the firefighting  industry has                                                               
completed a  lot of  testing and  research; in  fact, due  to his                                                               
experience with  testing, he  said he  would switch  to fluorine-                                                               
free    foam,   certificated    International   Civil    Aviation                                                               
Organization (ICAO), United Nations,  "level C foam" tomorrow, if                                                               
approved  by FAA.   He  acknowledged at  this time  fluorine-free                                                               
foam  is not  as effective  as aqueous  film-forming foam  (AFFF)                                                               
concentrates;  however,  AFFF  cannot  be  used  in  training  in                                                               
Washington, and  training can make  up for what  he characterized                                                               
as a three-second delay in extinguishment.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:14:25 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN opened public testimony on HB 240.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
1:14:50 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
RENEE LANI, Spokesperson, American  Chemistry Council (ACC), said                                                               
Section 1 of HB  240 seeks to ban AFFF, with  one exemption.  The                                                               
American  Chemistry  Council  is  opposed   to  HB  240  for  the                                                               
following  reasons:   AFFF is  the most  effective foam  to fight                                                               
high hazard level flammable liquid  fires in certain applications                                                               
and has proven effectiveness in  large-scale tank fires and other                                                               
high hazard Class B fires due  to its unique properties that have                                                               
been reported nationally and are  proven to protect firefighters.                                                               
Fluorine-free foams provide an  alternative in some applications,                                                               
such as  spill fires and smaller  tank fires, but do  not provide                                                               
the same  level of suppression  and other capabilities.   Certain                                                               
international  airports have  chosen to  switch to  fluorine-free                                                               
foams,   but  fluorinated   foams  are   used  in   petrochemical                                                               
facilities to  manage high  hazard fire risk.   Ms.  Lani pointed                                                               
out that although  HB 240 would allow continued use  of PFAS foam                                                               
by the oil and gas industry,  there may be other circumstances in                                                               
which  the use  of PFAS  foam is  necessary.   She said  any safe                                                               
alternative  identified by  the state  fire marshal  must provide                                                               
equivalent  performance to  AFFF formulations  to ensure  safety;                                                               
AFFF protects  life and property in  Class B fires and  should be                                                               
used  responsibly  and  discharges   contained.    She  said  ACC                                                               
supports  the  ban on  the  use  of  AFFF  in training  and  also                                                               
supports the  use of  best management  practices that  reduce the                                                               
discharge of  foam in all  uses.   In fact, legislation  in other                                                               
states  has required  the use  of best  practices and  banned the                                                               
release   of  PFAS   foam  into   the   environment,  except   in                                                               
emergencies, and ACC supports this  approach, rather than that of                                                               
HB 240.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:18:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK asked  Ms.  Lani to  clarify ACC's  specific                                                               
opposition to the bill.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MS.  LANI explained  ACC is  generally opposed  to [proposed  new                                                               
section] 46.03.350,  use of firefighting substances,  and instead                                                               
recommends legislation related  to the use of  best practices, as                                                               
has been  passed in Virginia  and Wisconsin, which  prohibits the                                                               
use of AFFF  in training and limits some use  in testing, but not                                                               
the  use of  AFFF when  needed.   She acknowledged  not all  fire                                                               
departments need AFFF because they respond to Class A fires.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  pointed out  46.03.350 would allow  for PFAS                                                               
use in the oil and gas  industry; he questioned whether ACC seeks                                                               
stronger or more restrictive language in the bill.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS. LANI said  subsection (a) is not broad enough.   For example,                                                               
Class  C fires  may also  involve ethanol;  therefore, industries                                                               
other than  the oil and gas  industry need to have  the option to                                                               
use AFFF.  Further, subsection (b)  does not make clear what safe                                                               
and effective means  in all circumstances.   She restated support                                                               
for legislation passed in Virginia [document not provided].                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
1:23:38 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR  inquired as  to ACC's  position on  adverse health                                                               
impacts related to the use of AFFF.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MS. LANI  stated the chemical  industry has always  supported the                                                               
use of  best practices to  manage any exposure to  chemicals; the                                                               
best  practices she  cited were  developed by  the Fire  Fighting                                                               
Foam  Coalition,  which is  an  association  that represents  the                                                               
manufacturers of fluorine-free and fluorinated foam.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR  restated her question  specific to  ACC's position                                                               
on adverse health effects from exposure to PFAS chemicals.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MS.  LANI said  PFAS  chemicals  describe a  very  broad term  of                                                               
chemistry that  poses varied hazards and  profiles; the chemistry                                                               
indicative   of  fluorinated   foam  currently   manufactured  is                                                               
represented  by  perfluorohexanoic  acid   (PFHxA)  that  is  not                                                               
carcinogenic or mutant  genic and does not  have developmental or                                                               
reproductive toxicity.   She urged for the use  of best practices                                                               
with all chemistries.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
1:26:22 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HANNAN questioned  whether PFHxA  has any  health                                                               
impacts.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS.  LANI   said  she   would  provide   citations  demonstrating                                                               
scientific support for PFHxA; she  said she could not address the                                                               
class   of  chemicals   identified   as  PFAS.     For   example,                                                               
fluoropolymer  is not  used in  firefighting foam  and cannot  be                                                               
absorbed  by  the body.    She  further explained  the  different                                                               
chemistries  known   as  PFAS   are  chemistries   with  specific                                                               
characteristics, and  she provided data specific  to PFHxA, which                                                               
is the chemistry of AFFF manufactured today.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN surmised  PFHxA is not a  chemical the bill                                                               
seeks to  regulate and is  not currently used in  the manufacture                                                               
of AFFF.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
MS. LANI restated PFHxA is currently used in AFFF.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN further asked  whether PFHxA has no adverse                                                               
health impacts or lasting environmental impacts.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS. LANI remarked:                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     I   think  that   the  weight   of  the   evidence  has                                                                    
     demonstrated  that   it  has  low  risk.     There  are                                                                    
     certainly --  I cannot  say that there  is not  a study                                                                    
     that  does  not  suggest,  you   know,  as  with  every                                                                    
     chemistry.   I have seen,  you know, for  instance, the                                                                    
     CDC used  to do  NHANES biomonitoring  tests for  it in                                                                    
     human blood,  but they actually stopped  testing for it                                                                    
     because they weren't finding it  in blood sampling that                                                                    
     they  do repeatedly.   We've  also  seen low  detection                                                                    
     limits of it across all  of the different water testing                                                                    
     that's being done in the  country right now, throughout                                                                    
     the country.  So, it  presents low risk, that chemistry                                                                    
     that's being used.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
1:29:07 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN recalled Ms.  Lani's earlier statement that                                                               
the bill  fails to  provide exceptions  for industries  with high                                                               
risk  for fire,  in addition  to the  oil and  gas industry,  and                                                               
asked what industries store a high concentration of ethanol.                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MS. LANI offered to provide further information.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN  stressed information that is  pertinent to                                                               
Alaska is needed to ensure fire safety in Alaska.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK returned attention  to [proposed new section]                                                               
46.03.050 [(b)],  noting the state  fire marshal  would determine                                                               
what   is  a   safe  and   effective,  alternative   firefighting                                                               
substance; he questioned ACC's opposition  to subsection (b), and                                                               
opined  that  the  fire  marshal should  be  trusted  to  protect                                                               
firefighter and public safety.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR  asked  Ms.  Lani   to  identify  the  alternative                                                               
chemical with no health effects.                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
MS.  LANI  clarified  the  current  chemistry  used  in  AFFF  is                                                               
perfluorohexanoic acid, known  as PFHxA.  In  further response to                                                               
Co-Chair Tarr, she said she  would provide additional information                                                               
on PFHxA, which is a long chain chemistry.                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
1:34:23 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MELANIE LESH informed the committee  she lives in Gustavus, which                                                               
is located near the pristine  waters of Glacier Bay National Park                                                               
and  Preserve.   She  said  Alaskans  are  lucky  to live  in  an                                                               
isolated and beautiful  state and there is irony in  that for the                                                               
past eighteen  months it has not  been safe for her  to drink her                                                               
well water;  one of the  benefits of HB  240 would be  to provide                                                               
blood  testing for  those who  have had  groundwater contaminated                                                               
with  PFAS chemicals.    Her oncologist  is  concerned about  the                                                               
chemicals to which  she has been exposed over 35  years living in                                                               
Gustavus, but  cannot provide testing.   The bill  would regulate                                                               
the use of PFAS chemicals and  also would provide plasma data for                                                               
those  who have  been exposed.   Ms.  Lesh recalled  testimony on                                                               
3/9/20 that revealed how important  blood testing had been in the                                                               
resolution   of  issues   that  were   raised  by   contamination                                                               
elsewhere.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  asked how the residents  of Gustavus learned                                                               
of the contamination.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MS.  LESH   said  the  Department  of   Transportation  &  Public                                                               
Facilities (DOT&PF)  leases a  parcel of land  at the  airport to                                                               
businesses, and  it was known for  years that no one  could drink                                                               
the water at the airport;  that awareness prompted testing of the                                                               
[toxic plume, which is a  underground pattern of contaminant] and                                                               
the realization that AFFF had entered the groundwater system.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  surmised DOT&PF had recommended  its lessees                                                               
not use the water.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MS.  LESH said  the  residents  of Gustavus  were  not warned  by                                                               
DOT&PF but were  aware, anecdotally, not to drink  from the water                                                               
fountain at  the airport,  so people began  to think  about their                                                               
wells.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
1:39:30 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
PAMELA  MILLER, Executive  Director, Alaska  Community Action  on                                                               
Toxics  (ACAT),  informed  the  committee  ACAT  is  a  statewide                                                               
environmental health,  research, and advocacy organization.   She                                                               
paraphrased from  written testimony dated 3/5/20  and included in                                                               
the committee packet [original punctuation provided]:                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     We appreciate your leadership in  sponsoring SB 176 and                                                                    
     HB  240,  respectively.   Alaska  Community  Action  on                                                                    
     Toxics (ACAT)  strongly supports  these bills.  We urge                                                                    
     passage by  the Senate  and House  Resources Committees                                                                    
     and full  legislature during the current  session. PFAS                                                                    
     contamination  represents   a  significant   threat  to                                                                    
     drinking  water sources  and  public health  throughout                                                                    
     Alaska.   This   requires   urgent  action   from   the                                                                    
     legislature  to  prevent   further  harm,  ensure  safe                                                                    
     drinking  water supplies  for contaminated  communities                                                                    
     and responsible  clean up, and measures  to monitor and                                                                    
     protect the  health of  affected community  members and                                                                    
     first responders.                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     In September  2019, ACAT released a  report: Threats to                                                                    
     Drinking Water  and Public Health in  Alaska: The Scope                                                                    
     of  the   PFAS  Problem,  Consequences   of  Regulatory                                                                    
     Inaction,  and Recommendations  (www.akaction.org). For                                                                    
     this  report,   we  reviewed   hundreds  of   pages  of                                                                    
     documents obtained  through public record  requests and                                                                    
     conducted  a  thorough   review  of  the  peer-reviewed                                                                    
     scientific  literature. In  Alaska, the  dispersive use                                                                    
     of AFFF  (aqueous film forming foam)  on military bases                                                                    
     and  airports has  contaminated the  drinking water  of                                                                    
     communities from  the North Slope to  southeast Alaska.                                                                    
     To  date,  PFAS  have  been   discovered  at  over  100                                                                    
     individual  sites  (mostly   "AFFF  source  areas")  in                                                                    
     nearly   30  locations.   The  State   of  Alaska   has                                                                    
     identified  33   airports  where   AFFF  is   known  or                                                                    
     suspected to  have been released into  the environment.                                                                    
     Of these, only  13 have been investigated  to date. Ten                                                                    
     Alaska communities  have PFAS  in their  drinking water                                                                    
     at  levels  deemed  unsafe by  the  U.S.  Environmental                                                                    
     Protection  Agency  (EPA) and  it  is  likely that  the                                                                    
     number  of  communities  with contaminated  water  will                                                                    
     grow  as  more  sampling is  conducted  throughout  the                                                                    
     state.                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     PFAS  are highly  toxic at  exceedingly  low levels  of                                                                    
     exposure. This  is a significant public  health concern                                                                    
     given  the latest  science  that  shows health  effects                                                                    
     including:   kidney   and   testicular   cancer,   high                                                                    
     cholesterol,  thyroid  disruption, ulcerative  colitis,                                                                    
     pregnancy-induced hypertension,  immune system effects,                                                                    
     and   effects   on   mammary  gland   development   and                                                                    
     breastfeeding  duration.   Firefighters  suffer  higher                                                                    
     rates of  cancer than the  general U.S.  population and                                                                    
     are at risk from occupational  exposures to PFAS. A new                                                                    
     study of women firefighters  showed that they face high                                                                    
     exposures to toxic PFAS chemicals.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     We  look  forward  to  working   with  members  of  the                                                                    
     legislature to ensure that the  bills are as protective                                                                    
     as possible  for the health  of all Alaskans.  Based on                                                                    
     current  scientific  evidence,  we recommend  a  class-                                                                    
     based  approach to  setting  water  standards for  PFAS                                                                    
     because    many    PFAS   chemicals    share    similar                                                                    
     toxicological properties and  adverse health endpoints,                                                                    
     often  at  extremely  low  exposure  levels.  The  goal                                                                    
     should be  to set a  maximum contaminant level  of zero                                                                    
     for the class to provide  a proper margin of safety for                                                                    
     vulnerable infants  and children and to  protect public                                                                    
     health  from  the  class of  PFAS  chemicals  that  are                                                                    
     extremely  persistent, highly  mobile, and  linked with                                                                    
     adverse health  effects at exceptionally low  levels of                                                                    
     exposure. A  combined limit of  2 ppt (for  PFOA, PFOS,                                                                    
     PFNA, PFHxS, PFHxA  and PFBS, with a  separate level of                                                                    
     5 ppt for  GenX) is reasonable given  that with current                                                                    
     technology, removal of PFAS is  feasible at that level.                                                                    
     Other states  are taking a more  class-based and health                                                                    
     protective approach.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     In order  to prevent further contamination  of drinking                                                                    
     water sources and other water  bodies, we also urge you                                                                    
     to  explicitly   prevent  the  discharge  or   use  for                                                                    
     training  purposes of  class B  firefighting foam  that                                                                    
     contains  PFAS  chemicals,  and  that  the  legislation                                                                    
     include a ban  on the use of PFAS  in firefighting foam                                                                    
     such as those that  have been supported by firefighters                                                                    
     and  enacted in  such states  as Washington,  Colorado,                                                                    
     and  New Hampshire.  On March  5, 2020,  the Washington                                                                    
     State    Legislature   overwhelmingly    approved   the                                                                    
     strongest state ban  in the country to  phase out toxic                                                                    
     PFAS  chemicals  in  firefighting  foam  and  eliminate                                                                    
     important  exemptions.  We  believe   that  this  is  a                                                                    
     precedent  that  the  Alaska State  Legislature  should                                                                    
     follow.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Thank you for your consideration.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
1:44:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
STEVE  RISOTTO, Spokesperson,  American  Chemistry Council,  said                                                               
although ACC  agrees with the  testing of drinking  water sources                                                               
in Alaska, and in minimizing  potential PFAS contamination by the                                                               
use of AFFF, ACC does not  support HB 240.  He directed attention                                                               
to [HB 240, proposed new Section  1] and said it is inappropriate                                                               
for a legislative body to  establish drinking water standards for                                                               
PFAS,  because establishing  water quality  standards requires  a                                                               
comprehensive  review  of   available  scientific  and  technical                                                               
information,   by  regulatory   authorities,  through   a  formal                                                               
rulemaking process.   He pointed  out the levels proposed  in the                                                               
bill are  based on  levels that have  been proposed  in Michigan,                                                               
and Alaska  should instead review  EPA's PFAS Action  Plan issued                                                               
in  2019,  and  EPA's  recent   announcement  to  move  ahead  to                                                               
establish drinking water  standards for PFOA and  PFOS, which are                                                               
two substances  for which EPA issued  lifetime health advisories.                                                               
In  2016, EPA  established health-based  guidelines for  PFOA and                                                               
PFOA at 70  parts per trillion in drinking water,  based on water                                                               
consumption, exposure  among sensitive populations,  and exposure                                                               
to other sources.  Turning to  the blood testing provision in the                                                               
bill, Mr.  Risotto said  widescale blood  testing should  only be                                                               
conducted  if based  on  analytical methods  and  followed by  an                                                               
objective interpretation  of results.  Further,  the PFAS testing                                                               
specified  in the  bill cannot  provide  information on  historic                                                               
exposure in  individuals or assist  in predicting  health effects                                                               
and,  thus,  would  accomplish  no   purpose.    Turning  to  the                                                               
liability provision  in the bill,  he said ACC also  has concerns                                                               
about how the bill assigns liability.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
1:47:33 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR  agreed with  the need for  an objective  review of                                                               
blood  testing data;  however, she  questioned how  blood testing                                                               
would  fail  to  differentiate   between  historic  exposure  and                                                               
current exposure.  She expressed  her understanding blood testing                                                               
would  provide information  about adverse  health impacts  but is                                                               
too expensive  for an  individual to afford.   Speaking  from her                                                               
own  perspective, Co-Chair  Tarr  advised  residents are  rightly                                                               
concerned about  their health and  the health of  their families,                                                               
and she elaborated.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. RISOTTO restated  there is no way to tie  a specific level to                                                               
a specific  health affect;  an individual  sample of  blood would                                                               
not  provide an  historic  profile  and is  very  limited in  its                                                               
ability to answer questions.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HANNAN  inquired as to  whether a series  of blood                                                               
tests, over  a span of time,  would indicate the source  of one's                                                               
exposure  and  differentiate   between  background  exposure  and                                                               
direct consumption.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR. RISOTTO said  the Centers for Disease  Control and Prevention                                                               
(CDC) have  been testing  for PFOA,  PFOS, and  other substances,                                                               
and testing has  shown a steady decline in blood  levels for PFOA                                                               
and  PFOS;  he explained  that  exposure  from dental  floss  and                                                               
cooking pans is from a polymer  that is unlikely to transfer into                                                               
the blood  of an individual because  of the size of  the molecule                                                               
and its insolubility.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HANNAN  questioned  whether blood  samples  taken                                                               
over  a period  of three  years, from  children exposed  to AFFF,                                                               
would  fail  to  reveal  health  risks  and  changing  levels  of                                                               
exposure.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR. RISOTTO acknowledged blood testing  would reveal the level of                                                               
exposure  but  would not  give  an  indication of  likely  health                                                               
effects due to a lack of data.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  TUCK inquired  as to  whether ACC  supports blood                                                               
testing of  responders to  a fire  but not  of residents  who are                                                               
exposed through drinking water in a community.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
MR. RISOTTO  agreed it would  be useful  to obtain a  baseline on                                                               
the level of exposure accumulated by first responders.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN asked Mr. Risotto  to recommend a useful testing                                                               
regime.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR. RISOTTO  said testing the  water drinking water  would reveal                                                               
community exposure; the CDC has  fairly extensive data on many of                                                               
the products.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
1:55:51 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
GREG STREVELER said he has lived  in Gustavus for 50 years and is                                                               
a  retired   Department  of  Natural  Resources   consultant  and                                                               
biologist.    He said  his  work  and his  joy  in  life are  his                                                               
interest in the beauty, connectivity,  and health of the Gustavus                                                               
ecosystem.   Mr. Streveler said  he serves  as a chemist  for the                                                               
Gustavus PFAS  Action Coalition group,  due to his  background in                                                               
organic chemistry, and he warned  levels of PFAS contamination in                                                               
Gustavus will come  to reflect those of other places,  which is a                                                               
real issue.   He pointed out  in the bill the  list of chemicals,                                                               
and their  cutoff concentrations, includes chemicals  about which                                                               
much is  known; as  more becomes known,  the allowable  parts per                                                               
trillion concentrations  are lowered.   He directed  attention to                                                               
the bill on page 2, lines 7-10, which read:                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     (b) For purposes of (a) of this section, the limit of                                                                      
     perfluoroalkyl substance or polyfluoroalkyl substance                                                                      
     contamination in water is the lesser of                                                                                    
         (1) the limit established by the department in                                                                         
     regulation; or                                                                                                             
          (2) the following limits:                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
MR.  STREVELER said  the  abovementioned  provision is  important                                                               
because  he  is convinced  -  as  testing continues  -  allowable                                                               
concentrations will  decline, and the bill  correctly sets limits                                                               
now,  and also  gives the  department flexibility  to reduce  the                                                               
limits if there are scientific reasons to do so.                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE TUCK  asked how the  community of  Gustavus became                                                               
aware of the problem with its drinking water.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. STREVELER explained  he became aware after  the National Park                                                               
Service, U.S.  Department of the  Interior, tested the  well that                                                               
provides water to Gustavus School, and the test was positive.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
2:00:15 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
DAVID  BERREY, spokesperson  for Wake  Up Alaskans  to the  Toxic                                                               
Environmental Reality  (WATER) said Fairbanks is  ground zero for                                                               
this issue  and residents  have had toxic  levels in  their wells                                                               
for many  years.  Mr.  Berrey said the chemical  companies refuse                                                               
to  take  responsibility  for contamination,  and  EPA  has  been                                                               
talking about studies and action  for 20-30 years, so states must                                                               
force responsibility onto the chemical  companies.  Alaska has no                                                               
chemical   industry,  but   North  Pole   is  contaminated   with                                                               
sulfolane.   Fairbanks has  plumes from  Eielson Air  Force Base,                                                               
the training center at the  airport, and Fort Wainwright, and its                                                               
high water  table is contaminated  with extremely high  counts of                                                               
PFOS and PFOA.   Mr. Berrey said small changes  made to chemicals                                                               
have led  to false  claims of safety  by the  chemical companies,                                                               
but they know there are just as many problems.  He remarked:                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     It's unconscionable what they're doing  to us.  It's up                                                                    
     to you to do something to  protect us.  We need to have                                                                    
     our  blood  tested  in  our area  to  show  that  we're                                                                    
     astronomically  high in  these chemicals.   There's  no                                                                    
     endemiological studies  being done;  there's no  way to                                                                    
     find the  data to  begin with.   We  need help.   We're                                                                    
     looking to you to help us.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
2:03:34 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  LINCOLN, after  ascertaining no  one further  wished to                                                               
testify, closed public testimony on HB 240.                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR TARR  recalled in last  year's capital budget  there was                                                               
funding  for  testing  and cleanup  of  PFAS  contamination,  and                                                               
intent language directing DOT&PF to  test for all PFAS chemicals,                                                               
not  only  PFOS  and  PFOA;   a  subsequent  report  from  DOT&PF                                                               
indicated  $165,000  has   been  spent  and  she   asked  for  an                                                               
additional update on ongoing work.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
2:05:14 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
JOHN  BINDER, Deputy  Commissioner, Office  of the  Commissioner,                                                               
Department of  Transportation &  Public Facilities,  informed the                                                               
committee it took DOT&PF and  DEC several months "freeing up that                                                               
money"  in  the capital  appropriation,  but  the delay  did  not                                                               
inhibit the actions  of the departments.   Testing is continuing,                                                               
and DOT&PF has responded appropriately  where tests are positive.                                                               
The  reimbursable  services agreements  (RSAs)  are  in place  to                                                               
access the capital funds and activities are well underway.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR  TARR asked  for written  details on  where testing  has                                                               
occurred, and the results, to  inform the committee on the status                                                               
of remediation and whether additional funds are necessary.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
MR. BINDER agreed to provide a summary.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE   HOPKINS  asked   what  action   is  taken   when                                                               
contamination is found,  in excess of DEC regulations,  at a site                                                               
or in a community.                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BINDER  explained  that  before a  site  is  tested,  DOT&PF                                                               
coordinates a workplan  with DEC; when results are  positive at a                                                               
certain level,  DOT&PF determines  a source  of clean  water and,                                                               
with  DEC  and  the  Division  of  Risk  Management  [within  the                                                               
Department of Administration], determines a long-term solution.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HOPKINS asked what is happening in Gustavus.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BINDER said  additional testing  in Gustavus  has identified                                                               
affected sites; there  are several options for  a long-term water                                                               
source, including  water treatment  and capturing rainwater  in a                                                               
cistern.   Each community is evaluated  individually to determine                                                               
the best long-term solution.                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
2:09:46 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE HOPKINS inquired as to  other sites in the process                                                               
of mitigation, in addition to Gustavus and Fairbanks.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BINDER  said seven  locations  out  of thirty-three  suspect                                                               
sites have been  tested.  Working with DEC and  the Department of                                                               
Natural  Resources  (DNR)  to garner  information  such  as  well                                                               
depths, groundwater flows, locations  of private wells, and other                                                               
factors, DOT&PF  categorized airports  into levels of  risk; nine                                                               
airports are at highest risk, and  all but Iliamna and Aniak have                                                               
been  tested.    Because  most of  the  suspect  plumes  surround                                                               
airports  in  rural areas,  private  wells  are contaminated  and                                                               
require individual solutions.   If a [clean]  public water source                                                               
is  available, a  connection  to public  water  is generally  the                                                               
preferred  long-term solution,  in fact,  Fairbanks International                                                               
Airport provided water from the city water supply.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SPOHNHOLZ  asked how  many  more  sites would  be                                                               
tested this year.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
MR. BINDER  was unsure  of how  many in  addition to  Iliamna and                                                               
Aniak.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE SPOHNHOLZ  asked for  an estimate  on the  cost of                                                               
testing the  remaining sites.   She surmised  long-term solutions                                                               
are to identify  a new source of water and  asked whether removal                                                               
of the contaminated plume would be an option.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
MR. BINDER  agreed to provide a  written estimate of costs.   The                                                               
department estimates $10  million would be needed to  test all of                                                               
the  remaining sites,  and  there would  be  additional costs  to                                                               
respond  to positive  results.   He said  "forever chemicals"  in                                                               
water are extremely difficult, if  not impossible, to remove from                                                               
the  ground, and  treating the  soil  saturated with  water is  a                                                               
difficult challenge.                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  SPOHNHOLZ   questioned  whether  soil   could  be                                                               
removed and replaced.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
2:15:04 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BINDER  further explained  once  the  chemicals are  in  the                                                               
groundwater,  even if  the  soil is  removed  and treated,  after                                                               
rain,  the  groundwater  will   re-contaminate  the  clean  soil;                                                               
however, he said  removing and treating the soil  may be possible                                                               
in   some  circumstances.     He   related   that  at   Fairbanks                                                               
International Airport, a contractor  is experimenting with carbon                                                               
injection   into  the   plume   to  treat   or  prevent   further                                                               
contamination, although results will be unknown for some time.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  HANNAN   asked  why   DOT&PF  began   testing  in                                                               
Gustavus.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
MR.  BINDER stated  awareness followed  projects  at Eielson  Air                                                               
Force Base  and in  Fairbanks.   The Department  of Environmental                                                               
Conservation requested testing at  Gustavus, and he expressed his                                                               
understanding  the near  location  of an  airport to  residential                                                               
wells raises the risk and concerns about this issue.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
2:18:08 PM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CO-CHAIR LINCOLN announced that HB 240 was held over.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                

Document Name Date/Time Subjects
HB240 Version A Sponsor Statement 2.28.2020.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Version A 2.07.2020.PDF HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Version A Sectional Summary 2.14.2020.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB240 ATSDR PFAS Information Sheet 02.13.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB240 EPA PFAS Information Sheet 02.13.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB240 Executive Summary - Michigan Report on PFAS Health Effect 02.13.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Testimony as of 3.6.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Draft CS Version M 3.6.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 CSHB24(RES) Version M--Sectional Summary 3.6.2020.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 24
HB 240
HB 240 Explanation of Changes, Ver. A to Ver. M 3.6.2020.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Fiscal Note - DPS-FLS 3.5.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Fiscal Note - DEC-SPAR 3.6.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Fiscal Note - DEC-EH 3.6.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/16/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 240 Testimony Received as of 3.8.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 240
HB 138 Draft CS v. K.pdf HRES 2/10/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/14/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/17/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/24/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 Sectional Analysis v. K 2.4.2020.pdf HRES 2/10/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/14/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/17/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/24/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 Sponsor Statement 2.4.2020.pdf HRES 2/10/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/14/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/17/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/24/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 Fiscal Note CS(RES)-DFG-CO-2-14-20.pdf HRES 2/17/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/24/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 Fiscal Note CSHB138-DNR-MLW-2-17-20.pdf HRES 2/17/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/24/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 Fiscal Note HB138CS(RES)-DEC-WIF-02-16-20.pdf HRES 2/17/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 2/24/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment One - Spohnholz 2.13.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Two - Tarr 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Three - Lincoln 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Four - Hannan 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Five - Hannan 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Six - Hannan 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Seven - Hannan 2.20.20.pdf HRES 2/24/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Eight - Hannan 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Nine - Tuck 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Ten - Spohnholz and Lincoln 2.20.20.pdf HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Eleven - Lincoln 2.21.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Twelve - Lincoln 3.3.20.pdf HRES 3/9/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/11/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Thirteen - Tarr 3.5.30.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Amendment Fourteen - Tarr 3.5.20.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Conceptual Amendment Fifteen - Tarr 3.9.30.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 HRES Conceptual Amendment Sixteen - Tarr 3.9.20.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 218 Transmittal Letter 1.28.20.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 218 V. A 1.27.20.PDF HFSH 2/13/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/20/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/18/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 218 Sectional Analysis 1.28.20.pdf HFSH 2/6/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/13/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/18/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 218 Fiscal Note 1.27.20.pdf HFSH 2/6/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/13/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/20/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/18/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 218 Logbook Use Summary 1.28.20.pdf HFSH 2/6/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/13/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 218 ADFG Letter of Support 1.28.20.pdf HFSH 2/13/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/20/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/18/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 218 Letter of Support SEAGO 2.12.20.pdf HFSH 2/13/2020 11:00:00 AM
HFSH 2/20/2020 11:00:00 AM
HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/18/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 218 CS(FSH) Version M 2.21.20.PDF HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HRES 3/18/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 218
HB 138 DEC Response Letter 2.24.20.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138
HB 138 DEC Response Letter 3.13.20.pdf HRES 3/13/2020 1:00:00 PM
HB 138